UAS News Podcast — 2013-11-20
Transcript
Music Welcome to the next installment of the UAS News Podcast Series where we interview newsmakers and discuss the news and applications that are relevant to the global unmanned technologies community. I'm your program host, Patrick Egan, and I say hello and welcome, as we always do, to our co-host, Mr. Gene Robinson. Hello, Patrick, and hello all.
Hope we're all having a good week and things are going well in the flying world. Well, you know, they always are. If you're here and you're listening, things are going good. I don't know if we're going to assume that anyway.
There you go. So any news stories catch your attention this week, Gene?
Well, what news stories haven't caught our attention? I mean, they're starting to come out as pretty hot and heavy these days. And we're seeing that more and more people are turning to the positive use of UA's, which tickles me to death. You know, we had one that one little incident where one went into one of the great lakes down there, but it was kind of overlooked that one and move on.
There's too many other good things happening out there for us to develop and dwell on one that just kind of happened to miss the pilot handoff and somebody hit the throttle switch and there you go. Yeah, you know, that one kind of concerns me as we talk about the red map, which we'll talk about a little in the back. But, you know, we can't have anything, say, four or five pounds with low kinetic energy flying around, you know, but they seem to keep making, let's say, allowances for these bigger systems to fly even though they crash all the time.
And I know I'll get, you know, feedback. They don't crash all the time. I'll get these bogus, you know, statistics. It's kind of funny, you know, even it was funny there was a story about Global Hawk.
Oh, you know, we've reached so many hours and, you know, my father-in-law lives up there near Beale and he's like, they fly in circles all night around the base. I'm like, oh, you know, they got to pad the hours, you know, yada yada. Anyway, you know, it's kind of funny. Got to bring the average up, but, you know, you got to justify $255 million a snap, I guess.
I wouldn't know. I can't afford that. Hey, anybody out there want to finance me for, you know, $255 million aircraft or a $55 million aircraft?
Email me. I'm interested in talking about terms. Oh, and I'm going to need insurance for that. I got a business plan.
Anyway. Well, if you have a place to fly it though, I mean, that's the problem. You're going to have to figure out a place to fly it. Oh, those are just details, Gene.
Do I really? I would have, I would have been like a dozen. I don't know. You know, I'll talk to, I got friends over there.
I'll talk to them about getting a COA to fly it for something. I don't know what. But anyway, so back to reality, what have you been up to?
Gosh, I think this is, should I say I've been flying? Yeah, I've been flying. That's what I've been doing. We've just completed another one of our research sessions on the, on the fire research end.
We're refining our data collection capabilities. We've kind of out there on the, on the cutting edge doing some stuff with, with infrared and the sensors and really kind of do a lot of ground cruising and that sort of thing. And it's been really fascinating to get into the science end of this. And I really do appreciate being able to take my skills out and to use them in a COA environment where you can actually fly and don't have to worry about somebody driving up a brown car with antennas bristling off of it.
And it's been a lot of fun doing a lot of work with the, with the Spectra 2. Working pretty hard on getting it, trying to get it into a 3D modeling scheme. I've already had some CSD done on it. And I'm, you know, I'm happy with the way it's been from the beginning anyway, but the CSD kind of just justifies where we've gone on this thing.
And I'm looking to try to maybe mass produce that guy. I think that'd be a good thing. So it's been pretty busy. I'm happy to hear that because I think, you know, I'm getting, you know, remember we had that super group telephone call six months ago with all the different, yeah.
And, you know, I got the reminder because I put it in my calendar that, hey, we're going to have the super group call again, which was a, you know, that was a million dollar phone call, but that might actually turn into a million dollar phone call. I actually got an email the other day. I'm serious. You know, people were, they, just like you just must have, I'm like, hey, this was like the super group call.
I did get an email the other day and it appears that some folks on the super group call are looking to move to let's say better suited aircraft for their applications. And so that might open up some opportunities for smaller manufacturers like yourself. We've got to talk about that offline. Okay.
Yeah. You're home now, Mommy. I don't know what the deal is, but I think you're home now. I just got the email last night.
It comes in here fast and furious, you know. I could do like two or three update calls a day, you know. Sometimes this stuff happens around here so fast I don't even know what's going on. I need three personal assistants, but I have none.
Anyway, that's a story for another time, but we'll talk about that. But the encouraging part of that, the really encouraging part of it is that some of these, let's say, users who have gotten equipment in free donations or whatever are realizing that they may be, you know, going at the finish work with a jackhammer. So I do think that people are coming around to that, and also I think they're starting to think that the DOD price points are just outrageously high. You could get a lot more work done, you know, like we talk about every week, is getting a better return on your investment.
I think people are starting to think that that may be the way to go. So let's talk about that some more. So I know you're doing some understatement on the WUE and all the rest of that. The work's coming along good, huh?
Yeah, it's, like I said, it's fascinating that the science end of it, the data collection, you know, really discovered what an unmanned aircraft can do in a pure research environment. And it's just really been great because it's contributed to some off-shoot sciences that I never would have even thought about for video processing and geo-rectification and ortho-rec and whole nine yards. And okay, I'll be right up front with you. Some of that stuff is kind of like voodoo to me, but you know, I kind of get it.
And I understand what they're doing with it, but you know, it's a little, you know, I get off in the WUE and they start talking technical stuff. Well, you know, it's a whole other science. But I love the updates. I mean, that's the other thing about this program is I mean, people get to hear weekly what people are really doing with this technology and you know, how we're really pushing the envelope.
And I think that's a good segue for our guest today, Mr. Gus Calderon. And Gus, are you out there?
I'm here, Patrick. Thanks for having me. Hey, well, you know, when people are doing stuff, we like to have them on the program. And you are doing stuff.
For folks that don't know, Gus was involved with the Volantis flying dress and was also the pilot for that, Lady Gaga. Oh, applause, applause, applause. I know, this was a live audience. We had never been clapping just like right now.
I couldn't believe it. I was watching the video, you know, I was like, who is this?
Wait, that's Gus. Yeah, well, I didn't know who was doing it, but I, you know, I watched that video before I found out it was you and we'll get into why that was. And I'm like, oh, you know, whoever's piloting that, no pressure there. There was zero bucker factor on that.
I can see that. That's what I said, I got it. He probably has like martini in one hand, a cigar in the other, and it's flying itself. Anyway, okay, so, you know, we've had you on the show before, I guess.
But maybe, you know, because not everybody listens to every episode, could you please introduce yourself to the audience, a little bio, how you got involved in small and end aircraft systems. Sure. My name is Gus Caldron. I'm an FAA certified commercial pilot, and I was very active in corporate and charter aviation until the major economic downturn in the economy around 2007.
At that time, I realized there would be a lot of potential for unmanned systems to do aerial photography and aerial filming, so I began doing some research and development with a group of local naval engineers here in San Diego. Several years ago, I really fixed my attention on multirotor platforms, and I started ISIS Copter, which is a small company building custom multirotor aerial solutions. Yes, okay,
and that all goes right into this, but since the last time you were on the show, and you were on the show again, or four, the reason was that you were telling us that you'd gone out for an exemption, you had applied for one for the FAA, and maybe possibly you can recap it for us and update us on the progress of that exemption, please.
Sure, because that's an interesting story now that I look back on it and see everything else that's going on, but in 2012 I went to the AUVSI convention in Las Vegas, and I spoke directly with FAA personnel from the UAS Integration Office in Washington, D.C., and they actually gave me a corner of hope. They told me that there was a new procedure which was developed to provide exemptions for small UAS operators who wanted to do commercial operations,
so I was very excited to hear that. They told me if I filled out my application right away, it could be one of the first ones, so I immediately rushed back to my hotel room, I filled out my online application, I sent everything in, and I actually didn't hear anything for several months, and then I got a call from Ben Velo at AUVSI saying, wow, I read the Federal Register every day, and I just saw
your petition for exemption was published in the Federal Register.
I had not known that because I don't read the Federal Register every day. And he said, wow, this is the first time I believe this has ever been published, and this could be groundbreaking. I was all excited, I thought this was wonderful, and there was a short comment period. Happy on the show, we kind of got the word out, a bunch of people made comments, and then nothing.
I never got a response back, and according to their own regulations, they had to respond in writing after a certain amount of time, even if it's a denial, which I was expecting to get. I had a couple of conversations with Ben Velo that he did some follow-up, and he said, I probably expected denial, but what I did not expect was to receive nothing, and that was probably about eight months ago. Now, it's possible it got lost in the mail, but I don't know, and I'm going to have to follow up on that actually.
I just think they're doing some other things, but really disappointing. At least I was expecting something, a letter of denial, a reason, or something. But really, at this point, I feel like I was sent on a wild goose chase, whether it was intentional or not. I'm not particularly happy about it, but this is the fact of what happened.
I'm a little surprised. I take the Federal Register and take it before them every day, because I've got a bird, and I need some, I need to line the page. The federal documents are great. Anyway, I think that's kind of interesting.
I already set that in, and I think it builds a little bit of a background for that, for what you do, and before we launch into this, too. You're also the executive producer for the Civilian's Roam documentary, which has caused a little bit of consternation in the advocacy community. Yes, it has. We've been getting a variety of different feedback.
We get a tremendous amount of positive feedback from individuals in the UA industry. We have not got a lot of support from, or really any support from the largest advocacy group, AVSI, for the unmanned industry. That's been kind of disappointing. And some other people have distanced themselves from us and from the film, because they are perhaps waiting either to receive a COA or to receive an FAA test site,
and they don't want to be associated with us, because they're saying that there were some parts of our film which were not positive about the FAA, while at the same time, every single person we spoke to has said what we put in that film was truthful.
It was honest and truthful. They were moved by it. They said it was powerful and emotional. They just, for whatever personal reasons, they need to distance themselves from the film.
So that's been a real eye-opening experience for us since we released the film a little over a month ago. Yeah, that's too bad. I mean, it's a repeated occurrence. And it's kind of funny, it's through this, I've seen that people are afraid to do anything because they're afraid of retaliation from the FAA.
But that doesn't sound to me like what, I mean, they're public employees and they work for us, and I think people have lost sight of that reality. I did have some discussions with people about it, and I'm not going to go into that today on today's show, but anybody that sees the film or even talks about the film could say, I mean, even myself, there were things that I may not totally agree with 100% in the film, but it doesn't really matter. I could still say objectively, hey, these people made this film, and these are some points.
I mean, really, as far as Mr. Miller is concerned, I think the gentleman has earned the right to talk about the situation almost in any way that he wants. Here's a guy, I mean, in the eye you see from the film, he's been emotionally torn to pieces. He's actually trying to help families and whatever else.
Why aren't we applying this technology from people to say, oh, well, you know, put the FAA in a bad light? You know, is that what you think?
What I think is, is that we have a technology that's ready to go to work, and why are we sitting on our hands? I don't think that that just puts anyone in a bad light. I say, where's the action?
That's personal. Yeah, I agree with you completely. Absolutely. And we have people demonstrating this technology right now.
I mean, there are people who are out there who have proven that this works. So it's just not hypothetical. This is factual. It is.
Gene, would you like to add some years to it? Sure. In my past life, I was a techno geek. I kind of used to call myself an alpha geek because I was a programmer and kind of worked with the lens environment and all that good stuff.
So, you know, I can keep up with, you know, who goes where and who visits what and that sort of thing. And I've got to tell you, the range of agencies and the range of countries that have come into my website as a direct link off of or a referral from or some sort of search from the Civilian Drones website has been absolutely phenomenal. I can tell you unequivocally that just about every agency you can think of in the federal government has been to the site and watched the movie. They may not say anything, but they have been there and they've watched the movie.
Agree or disagree, I don't know what they're doing, but I mean, even in places that you would, you know, never really consider, why don't they go look at it like the Department of Energy, why don't they go look at it? But, you know, maybe they were taking a break and they needed some entertainment so they watched it. We've got friends, we've got friends in all these agencies. I mean, DOE, there are actually people there that believe in this technology, all these different agencies.
You'd be surprised where that comes from. But I don't want to get too hired down to that. Yeah, I would just definitely say, guess what, you can get the website for the movie again for anybody who hasn't seen it. Yeah, it's civiliandronesmovie.com.
And actually just yesterday we announced a contest and a $500 cash prize. So I would encourage listeners to go take a look. But we're looking for some new artwork. So we're hoping that people will take a look, view the film, and come up with an illustration which really promotes the civilian use of this technology for search and rescue.
And I believe the contest ends in mid-January. So go take a look at the website, take a look at the movie, tell your friends about it, and go ahead and we'll put together an illustration, send it to us, and we'll announce the winner and give out a $500 cash prize. I stick figures aloud. Anything?
It's open to any? Anything at all, Patrick, anything at all. Okay, well, because you know I could use an extra Christmas cash. Yeah, I'm breaking out my nickel, pencil, and cheese, and cheese, and cheese, and chocolate right now.
All right, guys. It's just good. All right, so anyways, I wanted to talk about this, really the show is about the Lantus. And maybe for some of the listeners who've been on sabbatical climbing Mount Everest or who's had a power spin out for a while, North Korea, you could tell us a little bit about the Lantus.
Sure. The Lantus is essentially this Lady Gaga's flying dress. And what she wanted to do was incorporate a lot of this new technology and incorporate it into the fashion world and make a dress which could fly. This was completely her idea.
I was brought into this by Mike Henning, UAE Services, over the summer to work on it. Other people collaborated on this as well. And this is a small part of the team. There were some very, very brilliant people working on this.
Get into that a little bit later. But really what I've noticed is there's been a great deal of misunderstanding about the Lantus. A lot of people, I see a lot of negative comments. I stopped reading the comments because people are negative.
They just don't understand. They think it's some kind of just crazy stunt or whatever. And honestly, unless you were there, unless you really knew what was going on, you really don't get an understanding. And I was fortunate to be there and fortunate to understand what she's really doing.
It's actually pretty intense. And kind of what I'd like to do is to have the opportunity is I want to tell you what Lady Gaga says, the volunous is, because everybody can speculate. I can tell you. Other people can tell you.
But these are her direct quotes, if I may. Lady Gaga says, the Lantus is a vehicle. And it is also a metaphor for Lady Gaga. Lady Gaga is a vehicle for the voices of her fans and the youth all over the world.
And she said this at the press conference, by the way, and I wrote a lot of this down. And another thing that she said that really struck me, and she said that ivory towers have become so powerful that they begin to stifle the voices of the truly great minds. So her, isn't that interesting?
The recent lady, I believe she was only 27, I'm really impressed with her, with her outlook. She's demonstrated incredible leadership. She also goes on to say that she does not want young people to feel that they will never penetrate the corporate walls or the ivory towers. And then just wanted a quick quote.
She said, the Lantus is about opening that door to a new era and a new time for our ideas to take flight. I just wanted to share that with everybody who's listening so they have a little bit better understanding of what this was all about. That looks definitely a little bit deeper than I'll say the coverage has been. And it resonates with me, it's kind of funny, the first segment of the show is almost directly about that.
A lot of people believe, you know, like, oh, this technology was military. No, you know, not so much. You need to really go back and relearn that. But the ivory tower and the phythum has been created.
And now we are on the outside looking in. Gene?
Yeah. I totally agree with you. We've kind of suspected that the playing field was starting to tilt, you know, way back when. And if you're an entrepreneur or if you've been trying to break into this business for a while, you've got a very clear picture of this.
Well, just read the roadmap. The roadmap pretty much lays out, you know, mom and pop need not apply, you know. So we can, I think it's very timely. I'm really kind of impressed that she's that in tune with the technology ecosystem.
Pretty impressive. You know, I mean, I think of Lady Gaga and she's an entertainer and all the rest of that. But that seems like she's all plugged into reality. Your thoughts, guys?
Oh, absolutely. And she goes on if I may. These are really critical. What she went on to say was, Volantis was created by Tech House.
That's who I was working with. Tech House is affiliated with Studio XO, but they're also a division of House of Gaga. And what she said is Tech House is an independent, united group. You can come here with your ideas and we will finance them.
So she's not just about talk. She is putting her money out there to help fund ideas, bring up new ideas. She doesn't like to, she's not just talking about, you know, the ivory towers, the copper wall. She's saying here is, here's another path.
Here's another solution. If you have an idea, send it to us. Let's work together to bring this technology. I'm really, really impressed by that.
There was one other quote that really struck me too. It was one thing hearing it, but when I wrote down the quotes and then I read them, when there's a voice behind it or a young lady behind it, really these words took on even a more powerful meaning than I had originally perceived. But she went on to say if you are a public figure and you have the potential to start a revolution, I believe it is your duty to do so. So.
That's an interesting quote. Now, I mean some of these are quotes and whatever, but you did tell me in a brief conversation that you actually got to sit down and talk with her. I did, yes, and that was an absolutely incredible experience. And that happened before the media event.
It happened earlier in the day on Sunday. And you know, like most of us, I had only seen public images and the public persona of Lady Gaga until this album release in Brooklyn. So you know, it was a difficult week. It was very cold.
We were in a warehouse without heat doing flight testing and it was very challenging. And we ran into some problems and it was obviously a very stressful week leading up to that. And honestly, I just, you know, my professional opinion, I did not feel that we were ready. I'm a pretty cautious guy.
And I said, look, I said to our team leaders, I said I think we should just postpone this. I'm not really ready to do this. I don't advise this. So that got up to, you know, they communicated that to LD.
And then a team leader came back to me and said, LD would like to speak with you in her dressing room. And I said, fine, I'll just tell her myself. Again, at that time I didn't know her really. I had just seen her walk around a couple of times and I said, I'll just tell her myself, no problem.
So they accompanied me, a couple of 7 foot tall bodyguards accompanied me to her dressing room. And inside were her closest personal assistants, most of whom I've met previously. And we sat down and I started to explain my concerns, you know, about her safety and the problems that we were having. And then she told me she had done four more dangerous activities on stage.
She even broke my hip during a performance. And I said, look, I'm really, I'm trying everything here to get out. She said she took full responsibility for the flight, no matter what happened, it was on her. That's why she wanted me kind of in the background, so you would know who I was, whatever, just she was taking full responsibility.
And while she was speaking, I could really see such a strong look of determination on her face. It was just, it was unbelievable, that look. It was powerful. It was unlike anything I had even seen before.
And then she recounted some of her personal stories and how she became so successful by taking a chance when others told her not to do so. And I shared some personal stories with her about my reservation. It was an unbelievable experience on that Sunday afternoon, really. And she said, look, we're all on our personal journeys in life and we should not be dissuaded by others.
I have to say without a doubt she's one of the most inspirational human beings I've ever met in my life. And I've met a lot of people. So we had some other discussions I'd like to keep private, but then what she told me was literally there were millions of people around the world who were going to be watching the flight of the Atlantis that night if we proceeded. And if we were successful, we would inspire them to use technology to improve their lives.
Like I said, I'm a pretty cautious guy. I generally don't like to take risks, but sometimes risks must be taken to move the world forward, even if it's just a little nudge. So I said, all right, let's do this. And everybody jumped up and she got in her flight suit and we headed over the hangar.
And we did a test flight in the afternoon and then the following media event at 630 that night. Gus, can you convey in the most blatant terms how large the puffer factor was?
I don't think there were words that can describe that. The first flight was really incredibly, and there was talk of using a stunt double. And I know a lot of people said, oh, that wasn't her. Was it a stunt double?
No, it was her. She did not let anybody on that Atlantis but her. And after the first flight, which was not as smooth as the second one, there was some relief. But still the media event was, I will tell you this, I'm still recovering from that event emotionally and psychologically and physically.
It took every ounce of concentration that I had out of me to just keep it together and do that flight. It was, it was pushed beyond my limits, which is what she was trying to do to us, to show what can be done when you push yourself to the limits. So yeah, here I am. So in other words, it was just like your usual Sunday plan?
Nothing, yeah. It's a typical day out at the park. I usually do my flight training or research R&D out at the park. It was just like that.
I just put everything out of my mind. I mean, all I did was absolutely just focus. I went back to my commercial aviation training to fly the airplane. That's all I did, even though there were like 150 video cameras, TV cameras, hundreds of flashes going off in my eye.
And it was, they had spotlights on me and it was just, you know, my gosh, what next? You guys want to throw rocks at me while I try and do this?
It was so difficult. What about me while I'm doing this?
I mean, what next? It was pretty tough. But I mean, it's tough. And I say, one of the first big out of pros, because I've seen you work this, and you know, you may, you're like a duck, okay?
You could just all come on top and then peddle like hell underneath because I've seen all of them. Well, thanks, Gene. I did my best and that's what I promised from the beginning. I never promised that I would do the flight.
I said I would do my very best and that's all I tried to do. Well, that was one comment, too, that I wanted to make because I know you, you know, we talked about it briefly. You were like, you know, I told them I didn't really want to do this and I tried to get out of it and all the rest of that. And then I really immediately flashed in my brain that I'm glad that they were able to find somebody, a professional like yourself, who, you know, was really concerned about what they were doing and meticulous in their building and all the rest of that.
Because if it wasn't, it could have been a total disaster. And so I think we should all be happy for that and thankful. Well, yeah, thanks. Thanks, Patrick.
And there were a lot of other people who helped. But yeah, I would say it was critical. I mean, again, back in my aviation dream, we did extensive pre-flight and post-flight inspections. I mean, at every nut and bolt, every wire in between every flight.
I mean, we just took an absolute professional approach and did the best we could with what we had there in the timeframe that we had. And that does pay off. That really does make a difference. That's what we're right there.
Yeah, and I think exactly, I mean, this is kind of the message that we try to convey through all the work that we do at As Soon As It Stands and whatever else is, that is an example of what people should be emulating. You went ahead, you did something that was very risky, but you tried to make it, you went through the procedures to make it as safe as possible. And I think people, there's a lesson to be learned from that, you know. If it's not safe or it doesn't feel right or, you know, we don't cross the T's or dot the I's, it could be to the detriment of the whole industry.
So my hat's off to you on that, Gus. I appreciate that you're a professional in that way. And it's something for us all to emulate. Now, the flight was amazing.
And yes, it went up to the factor of 11, I know. But beyond that, tell us about the template for the Velanifest. Well, basically, it's a scale prototype, a scale flying prototype, which was actually based on the ISIS copter. I had given some demonstration flights to the people who were involved in this from the beginning, and they liked the way that it flew and how stable it was.
So they decided to kind of use that as the airframe. And then Studio XO and the rest of the design team and, you know, Mike Henning helped out with all this, pulling everything together. They designed the lower portion of the airframe. So I was basically concentrating on the power, the electric power system.
And I had some help from Matt Ryan, Ryan Mechatronics, you know, designing the upper part and some other people as well. And they did the, you know, the more dress part, the lower truss that was designed by their team, Studio XO and Tech House. That's how that came to be. Interesting.
So that's just a big ISIS copter. Well, the upper part is basically, yes, essentially it's an overgrown ISIS copter. Yes, yes. We really did.
And a lot of people said, you know, some people, you can't scale something up. A lot of people said, you can't do a lot of things and a lot of people were wrong. So, yes, you actually can scale this up. You can scale it up if you do it correctly.
We had to get some custom components made. I mean, we didn't just, you know, go to the local hobby shop and get some stuff and, you know, fold it together. You know, there were a lot of components that were made by fabricators in the San Diego area, highly skilled people. Were you using any Chinese electronics or, you know, I'm teasing.
I was looking, I was shuffling around in a bargain bin at the hobby shop. I think this will work. No, I'm teasing you. Well, you know, and for those that don't know an ISIS copter, maybe you could give them the website address so they could go and see the little, the dress's little brother.
The little brother, yes, isiscopter.com. They can go take a look and see what I do there. Okay. That's it.
Any questions? Yeah, isiscopter.com. If you have like, you know, anybody else wants to try this. Are you open for a rerun or what, Gus?
Yes, no? I'm still recovering right now. I would say to people at home, don't do this at home. I would definitely suggest that, yeah, strongly do not do this at home.
That's good advice for a lot of things, but especially here because I think that could, yeah, that's the best. All right. Well, I appreciate that. And we're going to move into the next segment.
And you are welcome to stay here because we'll actually talk about some other stuff that you were also a part of. But before we move to that next segment, any other closing comments, Gene, on the Volantis segment?
Well, I think that, like I said, I'm glad that I agree that Gus was the pro that was on the job. And to be honest with you, better you than me, because I can't possibly, you know, one of those stroke or coppy seizures when all the flash drives went off. Good job. That's all I'm going to say.
Thanks, Gene. That's funny. All right. Well, you know, let's talk about some of the contemporary developments.
The other thing that was going on is the Cal UAS portal at Portal Day. And I wasn't going to go because it's about seven mile or seven hour plus from where I live. But I drove down there and I figured, you know, hey, we've been talking about this test center thing and the proponents and all the rest of that. And, you know, I kind of had to see, let's say, the manifestation of the plan for myself.
So I jumped in the car and I drove down there and all of a sudden the guest was there and it was like, Ma, which was kind of a surprise. But my impression from the outset is that they have a nice facility. They have a boatload of community support. A lot of people turned out.
And I will say that Eileen Shibley has done a commendable job bringing all the parties and support together. You know, they've got a lot of great airspace out there. I don't think privacy is going to be an issue. I wish there was a little bit more support from California state government.
But that's just not really like them to, let's say, jump in with both feet if an idea makes sense. If it makes no sense, they're in with both feet. It's great. How much money do you need?
If it makes sense, it's kind of something different. But those were some of the things that I saw from my experience. And Gus, you were out there. Do you have anything you'd like to impart on us?
Well, yeah. What you just mentioned right there, I think that was one of the biggest surprises to me when I heard Eileen say that the politicians had set up a bucket for this program, but they didn't put any money in it. I was really surprised that there was nobody within the state California government at all that put any funding into that. I was actually really disappointed to hear that.
And I want to explore that some more. And honestly, that was probably one of the most shocking things I took away from that event. Well, you know, even that one, the state one is kind of one thing. But even when the language of HR 658 was turned into the modernization, reauthorization bill, I mean, I was privy to that prior to it being submitted.
And I brought that point up. I said, there's no money. I've never heard of any government effort going forward without money. But then it's just me.
I don't know. I don't either. So that was another big mistake. You know, I do think that she has gotten a piece, this innovation center, they did get that designation.
I do think that her model is probably the most small business innovation friendly. I do think that but it was interesting to see. And so I'm glad I took the time shot down there and shot that. It was a big field trip.
But, you know, it was good to see. What do you think?
Yeah, I'm glad I went as well. And I was glad to see that there are some small business people like Parisi and Parisi Aviation getting involved up there. She's driving up from LA once a week and they're doing work. And they're really determined up there.
The positive thing that I heard from Eileen is no matter what happens, she said she's got applications in for them to get a call. I mean, they're going to be doing flight testing up there in one way or another. If it doesn't become a test site, then they're going to be flying in calls up there. And I do hope they become a test site, obviously.
But it's a perfect place for it. There's absolutely nothing out there. And I don't see any reason. If that area gets denied for flight testing, then we're all sunk basically.
Yeah, well, that's going to be a real crap shoot. But I'm interested in that because Jeff was at the Small Inland Systems Business Expo. And that's where he met Eileen. She spoke of that.
You also spoke of that, Jeff. I keep telling people that the caliber of folks that we had at number one was just staggering, all uninspiring. And so, yeah, I mean, I know Maha is on the, your wife is on the docket to speak at SUSB Expo 2 in May. Don't miss it.
It's going to be great. I understand. Out of the way. How did you do that?
How did you get Maha to speak? She doesn't speak public business. I know. I was pretty tough.
There were a lot of long discussions at home about that. He's coming around slowly. He's coming around. Okay.
You've got some of your meditations from the Lady Gaga site. Take these. And we're just in front of the crowd. Other contemporary developments for people that may have read the new essay Roadmap Story, which, by the way, I got lots of supporting feedback.
I'm not saying positive, but anyone that has read it certainly really doesn't have many positive things to say. I know that you guys read the story, Gene, what are your thoughts on the story?
So I've read it the day it came out. Are you kidding?
I've read through it two or three times, and the usual sorts of bureaucracy comes out. You know, I think probably what I took a pinch at more than anything else, and it was almost personal, is the preaching that we got that, you know, making a regulation is a complicated issue and it takes a long time. So we're projecting five years for most regulations, but since this one is so complex, we're going to say five to ten years. I thought to myself, what have we been doing since 2007?
Junkets, you know, traveling around the world, doing nothing. I don't know, you know, it's a lot of nothing. Gus, are you willing to stick your toe in this pool?
Yeah, I only read the first page or two and it turned my stomach, so I couldn't read the rest of it, but I pretty much got the same feeling you guys did just from the first page or two and the wording in there. I knew the rest of it was just disappointing, you know, talking so much about privacy and how we have to investigate that and do more research and reports and all this kind of stuff. It was just really disappointing, that's all I can say. Oh, and let me just tell you, there's no funding for any of that either.
I want to say that the wheels are off the cart, it's pretty sad, but there is, you know, there is light at the end of the tunnel, my friends. And that light at the end of the tunnel is, I did get an email back from Peggy Gilligan at the end of that story. You can check out the document, basically the letter I wrote her again about the concurrent arc going on, because in the roadmap it had mentioned that,
you know, the people on that arc are going to take a look at some of the stuff from the small rule and the NPRM and the work that the small arc did and everything else, which I contended two years ago, and that there was no small business representation.
So I sent another letter to Peggy Gilligan, and I will say that I did get a response, and they are going to have a meeting about it again, about small business representation, and it was cc'd to some MTAs at the FAA, including the head of the UASIO. So I'm not holding my breath that the small business person is going to get representation, but it's been, one thing I can say is it's been two years and I'm not giving up yet. I'm going to be riding this deal for a while. And so we're following up on that and we'll be letting people know if there's anything else that comes with that.
It could be positive things, so maybe there's some change. The other one other thing I wanted to mention is, you know, I did with the test site thing here that somebody ran an idea, Jock made the idea, it's a flagpole that there would be, with six test centers, there would be one test center that administered or ran all of the other test centers. And I have some immediate impressions come to mind. Anybody care to touch on that one, Gene?
Well, we're kind of going back to a centralized government model. And I don't see that. I mean, this will kind of call me off guard, you know, when we spoke about it earlier this morning. The autonomy, oh, there's that word again, of being able to do what we do is being subjugated.
I just, where are we going? I'm concerned. I don't know whether even the six test centers will even be productive under that model. But, you know, maybe I'm wrong.
Maybe a centralized sort of administration will work. Well, you know, I don't know. I don't think the head hotch of things is going to work in the administration from one group, because I think they're going to try and control it. There's other ideas.
I mean, people are hatching all these ideas and throwing them out there. But I think that we need to remember that the test center idea was something where they could get the data that the FAA has been talking about getting since 2004, 3, 2, 1, whatever, to be able to make rules. You've got to have data, right?
I mean, if you're not making rules off of, let's say, empirical data, then it's just conjecture. So with that said, I think it's time to get off the wheel of suffering and say, hey, this is what we're going to do. We're going to make these test batches. We've got to get to work now.
How are we going to hit that 2015, September 2015 deadline where we got full access to the NAS if we don't get the test centers going now? I left you speechless, right, Gene?
You know, as you're preaching to the choir on that one, Bubbles, gosh. That's going to be hard to do. That's hard to say. I guess you even want to put, get in it.
Come on in, I guess. I'm just so befuddled by this whole process. I don't even know why there are only six test centers to begin with in such a huge country. I'm really speechless about this whole thing.
But I really just hope that there's some sort of positive, whatever it is, however small, I just hope we see something soon. I heard talk of a couple months that we're saying something by December. Really, if there's nothing happening before the end of the year, then I'm going to be even more discouraged than now. Well, I hate to be there.
Bad news. Oh, no. This is, you know, putting the tofu in the chili bean here. Unfortunately, lately, one of the other things that I hear is that, you know, we remember we were talking about December 2013, they were going to do the test center thing.
Right. And they were going to, the NPR was coming out this year, December was rolling out. Well, it looks like the timeline may have flipped a little. Yeah, on the top.
It appears that the NPR may have a slip till May. And, you know, I'm going to ask Gene here because Gene's a relative newcomer. You know, well, we know the slip season, right?
Gene, usually you get the slip like in March. It's like, well, it's not going to be spring. It'll be early summer. And then early summer may rolls around.
Oh, well, it'll be fall. You know, we'll have that out and blah, blah, blah. And my character that I misunderstand in the last six, seven, eight years. You know, we kind of got, we laugh about it and we kind of joke about it.
But, you know, it's painfully apparent. We've watched this happen for eight years, really. You know, like you say, what's really just concerning is sometimes they move it out even further than going from, it won't be the spring, it'll be the summer. They say, it won't be the spring, it's going to be fall.
Yes. Well, I call it the letdown season. You know, usually everybody's all fired up in the spring and we're going to get something going. And everybody's, you know, making their plans and, you know, blah, blah, blah.
And then, you know, then we have the slip starts kicking in where the gears are grinding and whatnot. But, you know, as we hear here, the only one with the test I think, it was suggested that they may not kick that off and say, oh, it's, you know, you know, shimloy again and pick up C and poxitony or wherever these towns are going to be. They might release one or two. I don't think it's going to be some big revelation because we already got two already.
But anyway, it'll be interesting to see how this plays out. We ran along again today. But again, really great conversation. Guys, you know, giving us the inside scoop on the Lady Gaga thing was great.
I appreciate you coming on. And, you know, I'm sure we're going to do some more stuff in the future because it really looks like you and your wife are coming on strong in this sector. I don't know what it looks like. It's very apparent, you know, that you're going to be moving and shaking in this sector.
Yeah, you know, I'm very glad that you came on today and you were able to talk with us. Well, thanks for having me, Patrick. I appreciate it. And we want to do everything we can.
I mean, you and Gene have been doing this for so long. I just cannot even believe the inner strength that you guys have. So thanks to both of you guys for the UAS advocacy effort. And we're trying to bring some new strength and try and revitalize what you guys are doing and get some more people on board.
All we want to do is help out. Well, I appreciate that. And Gene, until next week. Indeed, try to keep the nose out of the alfalfa.
All right, we'll hear everyone next week. Take care, guys.